Posts by Hobo Ken

116

Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall

by Hobo Ken in

jw
friends

this is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.

he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.

this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.

Hobo Ken

Let me give you an example of the mentality of Ronnie Hunter he said to me " I have absolutely no doubt that the Kingdom was established in 1914"

Paul Barrie" the kingdom being established in 1914 is a cornerstone teaching, it will never be changed"

There must have been people like these two back in the day who believed that Christs presence in 1874 was an equally immovable object in their faith.

Now I would ask , if you have conditioned your mind as much as these two that something is an immutable fact and will never be anything but what happens when the organisation changes it ? They will eventually discard 1914 or more likely downgrade it's importance. They are already doing it ,in my view with their 1919 appointment dogma.

When this happens what effect will it have on men like these and their confidence in the organisations teachings?

The organisation's fanatics like Ron and Paul will be slapped in the face by their own Governing Body.

People like us won't even have to lift a finger.

Matt

116

Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall

by Hobo Ken in

jw
friends

this is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.

he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.

this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.

Hobo Ken

I think that given the memorial was a few months ago it's wierd how he's still going on about it in the middle of June.

I mean why not "look at the assembly coming up in a few weeks", or even use the meeting that night as a stark contrast between tthem and the world.

I wonder if given the fact he falsely testified about my views on the memorial and who should partake (when I hadn't even discussed it with him) whether this is evidence that it's on his mind a lot. The usual witness mentality is to look forward to the next bountious spiritual provision not back in the calendar.

Ironically he used to work for a company called provident.......

116

Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall

by Hobo Ken in

jw
friends

this is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.

he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.

this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.

Hobo Ken

I just wanted a record to personally recall what was said but it soon became clear that the lies and doublespeak was something that others should hear. If this is representative of how elders deal with those who question the teachings then things were a lot worse than I thought.

The judicials are pretty good too.

Once the series of podcasts are completed then I will post them to other sites including youtube if possible.

Matt.

116

Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall

by Hobo Ken in

jw
friends

this is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.

he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.

this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.

Hobo Ken

bttt

116

Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall

by Hobo Ken in

jw
friends

this is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.

he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.

this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.

Hobo Ken

>scotsman

The impact is being felt I assure you. It's noticable that local JW's are posting on this forum and on my blog.

Regarding Ron , you are right in the grand scheme he is a nobody but not within the Oranisation in this country.

If he has some kind of attitude change or slows down because of persistent doubts and thinks back to thses events then this WILL affect others who look up to him. Plus the local elders are aware of my blog and the recordings so that will have an unsettling effect on them and him in particular.

You are right about seeing it happening time and again and you are correct that the biggest thing is in fact leaving.

I notice you describe it as "regular waves" of people leaving. What effect do waves have on a shore? They errode, and eventually over time cause a change in the landscape. Little by little they will be weakened. Also don't forget the internet is a massive weapon that ex jW's who left in the 70's and 80's didn't have. Can you imagine if Ray Franz left the GB just now and used the platform of the net to air a digital record of it all and have a website exposing them?

>justhuman

Well done. If you want to share it I'd personally like to hear that.

Hobo.

116

Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall

by Hobo Ken in

jw
friends

this is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.

he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.

this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.

Hobo Ken

>luo buo to

I know what I believe about Jesus but he can decide for himself if he wants to argue against the Bible itself.

>Judge

Well said. It can get you very fired up eh?

Thanks for your solidarity. Down with the Watchtower!

>Sweet pea

Thank you for your kind sympathetic words , to Lorraine especially. This has hit her hard. Iv'e known for many years that the Watchtower Society was teaching falsehoods but Lorraine has that realisation plus all the shunning baggage. It's a tough deal for the "weaker vessel".......

>scotsman, Ninja and Password.

I agree partially that men like him and my brother may never leave the WTS but at least they got to hear why WE all left.

It will bother him and Paul in their quiet moments for the rest of their lives......

hobo.

116

Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall

by Hobo Ken in

jw
friends

this is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.

he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.

this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.

Hobo Ken

Thanks for all the support people....Much appreciated.

I would like to state for the record that this particular man was aware of the issues involved as you will hear in a certain section of the judicial coming up. He gives an almost flawless picture of what I believed at the time some of which was based on what was said on this podcast. He knew where the battle lines were alright.

Regarding mentioning Jesus and 607 , he you will recall was the one who turned the conversation on to doctrinal matters. He obviously felt that would take the heat off him and into more "comfortable territory". That was why I responded with that material. It shook him up big time.....he says so at the judicial.

I was there to confront him on the lies and slurs on our character and our children. He obviously was uncomfortable and "caught on the hop", what a shame.....it didn't stop him getting me out of bed one Saturday morning by sending two of his cronies to tell me that in four days I was being put on trial for apostasy and he was one of the chief witnesses at the trial.

It did take a lot out of me to go down on Dec 25, in a pair of denims and a beanie hat, to the kingdom hall and confront the top dog for his atrocious behaviour. But it needed to be done. If he comes out of it looking bad then I'm sorry for him. But no matter how much you polish a turd it will always be a turd.( I'm not saying he's a turd btw)He represents a hateful , corrupt and immoral religious entity which he in fact worships. How can you look good when you represent that?

It's like when you see a top barrister representing a guy who's blatantly guilty of some heinous crime. How do you feel? Do you think he's just doing his job?

He knows the guy did it , the guy knows he did it, we all know he did it but the trial goes on, through the motions.

That's the feeling I have about my exchanges with this guy. You kind of lose any regard for him when you actually know what he's trying to defend.

Hobo.

116

Show-down with elder at the kingdom hall

by Hobo Ken in

jw
friends

this is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.. this was recorded on christmas day 2008.. after our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a jehovah's witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in november 2008.. we had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter.

he also made false statements about one of my children.. i decided to confront this elder at the kingdom hall.

this podcast is the recording of our conversation.. notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to jehovah's witnesses.. i ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a jehovah's witness?.

Hobo Ken

This is podcast 8 in the death or obedience series.

This was recorded on Christmas Day 2008. After our last visit from two local elders my wife felt she could no longer be known as a Jehovah's Witness and had chosen to disassociate herself in November 2008. We had been on a family holiday and had returned to find that one of the local elders who had visited us had warned off my mother-in-law from having anything to do with my wife - her daughter. He also made false statements about one of my children. I decided to confront this elder at the Kingdom Hall. This podcast is the recording of our conversation. Notice how he denies making such statements to my mother-in-law and falsely accuses me of teaching her beliefs contrary to Jehovah's Witnesses. I ask whether it's a sin to no longer be a Jehovah's Witness?

He also clearly states his position regarding the worship of Jesus. I firmly believe that as a result of this conversation this elder initiated judicial proceedings against me the following month. Podcasts from this judicial hearing will follow shortly. here is podcast-8 Also free on itunes Matt.

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